Cyclamen Society show pt.1

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Author Message   Tim  Posted on Sunday, October 30, 2005 - 04:45 am EST :    Let's start with a few C. hederifolium. Some great plants on show yesterday. The plant in the last photo is mine. It's C. hederifolium ex. CSE93154. Believe it or not, so is the plant in the third photo. Both were grown from seed taken from the same collected plant. The original looks nothing like my plant. The plant in the third photo looks much closer to the original. Goes to show how variable seedlings from the same parent can be. The plant in the third and fourth photo along with my plant were in the same class, which was for progeny of Society collected plants. Plant in the fourth photo got first, plant in the third photo along with my plant were given equal second, and the plant below was given third. It's another one of mine, and is C. persicum ex. CSE90560. Tim - Cambridgeshire, Zone "7 "   Galanthophile  My Favorite Photo My Garden Posted on Sunday, October 30, 2005 - 05:12 am EST :    What a superb selection. I'm not surprised that 4th plant won although I think they are all gorgeous. Well done for that 3rd spot :) Galanthophile - Ann (Northern England), Zone "8"   Carol23  Posted on Sunday, October 30, 2005 - 06:21 am EST :    How exciting, Tim! I think your plants are outstanding! It's amazing the leaf variations from the same parent plant. I've just seen the first leaf from one of my more unusual Cyclamen and it's not like the parent! Your persicum is quite unusual. I've not seen anything like it. The judges must have had a tough time. Carol23 - Southeastern PA, Zone "6B"   Terryk  My Weather My Garden My Time Posted on Sunday, October 30, 2005 - 07:06 am EST :    Congratulations Tim! You have some beauties there. This must have made for a great day. It is amazing how much variation in leaf pattern there is. The size of those plants is fantastic too. Terryk - NY, Zone "6"   Matthias  Posted on Sunday, October 30, 2005 - 11:09 am EST :    If you hadnīt told us I would, at first sight, have mistaken the plant in the second photo for C. repandum. The differences between the silver leaf plant and yours from the same parent are striking. Can this be attributed to outcrossing? C. hederifolium has so many virtues on top of its winter hardiness! The leaf in the fourth photo is very beautiful as is your C. persicum. Congratulations for your awards, Tim. Matthias - Southern Germany, Zone "7"   Shirley1md  Posted on Monday, October 31, 2005 - 07:20 pm EST :    Your plants are beautiful! Congratulations on winning your ribbons! Shirley Maryland Zone 7a   Tim  Posted on Friday, November 04, 2005 - 12:45 am EST :    I don't know if it is due to outcrossing, Matthias. I had always put it down to the fact that offspring from a parent can be variable, but having said that, I don't know enough about it. The original plant was collected near Leonidi in Greece, and from what I've seen, the plants in that area have a certain feel about them. I do know people who can look at hederifolium collected from various sites in Greece (including the islands) and can tell whereabouts (roughly, of course) they were collected. I would have thought that if the plant in photo 3, which resembles the parent plant (CSE93154) was isolated, it would produce variable offspring. Some of those with less silver would be very attractive. That would be a nice leaf for repandum, wouldn't it? As you already know Matthias, nearly all repandum in the wild have a green leaf with a silver hastate pattern, but back in 2003, Martyn Denney and Richard Bailey went on a Cyclamen Society field trip to Corsica and found some plants with leaf patterns very close to the pattern you see on the hederifolium leaves in photo 4 above - silver with a narrow green edge. Some were collected and it is hoped to be able to stabilise the trait. Tim - Cambridgeshire, Zone "7 "   Matthias  Posted on Friday, November 04, 2005 - 08:16 am EST :    10 of the 14 tiny seedlings I have from your Silver Leaf C. hederifolium, Tim, have silver leaves with narrow green edges, 4 are green with the usual hastate pattern. I think this high percentage of "true" offspring must be the result of self pollination (inbreeding). I used to have only one very mediocre C. hederifolium in my garden for many years and I have seen hundreds of seedlings from self pollinations over the years, most of them mediocre like the parent but there were a few exciting seedlings among them. The following photo of a very typical Italian C. repandum in the background together with Helleborus liguricus was taken in western Tuscany/Italy in mid June a few years ago. Should be exciting to go to Corsica which is not too far away from the coast of Tuscany and which can be seen on the horizon in clear weather. Matthias - Southern Germany, Zone "7"   Terryk  My Weather My Garden My Time Posted on Friday, November 04, 2005 - 09:05 am EST :    The bags are being packed again Matthias?! It is so nice to have someone who travels to so many different areas and reports back on his findings. It allows those of us so far away take the trip with you and learn from you. Tim it is amazing that people can narrow down where a plant originated from so well and here I am wondering what those unlabeled pots hold! Terryk - NY, Zone "6"   Tim  Posted on Friday, November 04, 2005 - 09:31 am EST :    Typical C. repandum then Matthias. Have you ever seen anything a little different? More silver on the leaves perhaps? Below is a photo of repandum taken on Cres. For those of you who might not know where, or what Cres (pronounced 'Tress') is, it's a small island off of the coast of Croatia in the Kvarner Gulf. Cres is the only place I've seen C. repandum and C. purpurascens growing in mixed populations. Very interesting vulture sanctuary there too. There are wild populations of Griffon vultures on the island, but they are now sustained by man. Carcasses are taken up to the cliffs where they live. They used to be able to sustain themselves, but can no longer do so because of the decline in cattle and sheep farming, which has lead to a food shortage for the birds. Nice ferry ride to the island too. Tim - Cambridgeshire, Zone "7 "   Matthias  Posted on Sunday, November 06, 2005 - 06:16 am EST :    Tim, in February 2001 while doing botanical fieldwork in Sicily I saw plenty of Cylamen hederifolium and repandum growing side by side together with Helleborus bocconei and, in some sites white Paeony mascula. I remember one site with thousands of spectacular C. hederifolium with huge leaves and breathtaking silver patterns. I just admired them and didnīt take any photos. The following photo was taken for the hellebore but there are a few C. repandum around with wider silver patterns. Iīm sure you would be able to find exciting leaves in this colony. Matthias - Southern Germany, Zone "7"   Tim  Posted on Sunday, November 06, 2005 - 07:02 am EST :    There are some superb repandum leaves in that photo Matthias. The leaf in the bottom left of the photo, the one which is obscured slightly by a twig - that's a very nice leaf. Reminiscent of C. balearicum I think. The leaves in the top of the photo are good too. So, another reason to go to Sicily then... Oh, and the hellebore isn't bad either Tim - Cambridgeshire, Zone "7 "   Matthias  Posted on Sunday, November 06, 2005 - 07:38 am EST :    Hereīs a larger version of that leaf, Tim. The one in the lower right corner of the main photo is even better. Matthias - Southern Germany, Zone "7"   Terryk  My Weather My Garden My Time Posted on Sunday, November 06, 2005 - 08:00 am EST :    Oh those are wonderful (and as Tim says, so is the hellebore)! So when are you packing your bags Tim and/or Matthias? Would the hellebore and cyclamen be setting seed at the same time? Could we be so lucky. Terryk - NY, Zone "6"   Tim  Posted on Sunday, November 06, 2005 - 11:43 am EST :    That photo of repandum I posted on Friday wasn't taken on Cres. It was taken on an island next door called Krk (a few km's away from a place called Dobrinj). I've so many sites in my head now, that things do get a little muddled from time to time - well, a lot of the time, but that's a whole different issue to do with me having the memory span of a goldfish... Everything else within that posting is correct though, just the photo location was wrong. I visited Cres and Krk in late May 2002, Terry. There were one or two very late flowers on the cyclamen - most had set seed and the pods were coiled down and swelling. Hellebore seed was only just ripe, and cyclamen seed was probably a month or so away. C. repandum seed ripens here in late June/early July. I like the close up of that leaf, Matthias. I missed the leaf in the bottom right - looks like there is a large silver shield on that one. It's similar to the plants found on Corsica by the Cyclamen Society, although not quite as much silver. I'd be glad to have anything close to those in you photo in my collection. I'd like to exhibit something like that at a show, just to see if the judges could identify it correctly. Tim - Cambridgeshire, Zone "7 "   Matthias  Posted on Sunday, November 06, 2005 - 01:22 pm EST :    For Tim: (maximum quality I can get out of this blurred slide scan) Matthias - Southern Germany, Zone "7"   Tim  Posted on Sunday, November 06, 2005 - 02:25 pm EST :    Thanks Matthias. That is an exceptional leaf for repandum. My C.x meiklei (creticum x repandum) look similar, at least at first glance, anyway. There isn't so much of a resemblance to balearicum now I can see the leaf close up. Below is a photo of one of my C.x meiklei for comparison. The shape of the leaf is a little different, but the pattern is similar. Don't know if I've asked you this before Matthias - have you ever seen C. repandum forma Album in the wild? Or perhaps a plant with a white flower and a darker nose? Tim - Cambridgeshire, Zone "7 "   Tim  Posted on Monday, November 07, 2005 - 02:24 pm EST :    Right then - another amendment to an earlier post. I have seen C. purpurascens and C. repandum growing together on Krk, not Cres as I had stated in that post. I've seen only C. repandum growing on Cres. Anyway, two errors in one post... shocking. Everything about the vultures on Cres - that's all correct, just the bits about the plants that wasn't! Sorry about that Tim - Cambridgeshire, Zone "7 "

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